PHIL JONES INTERVIEW: How he plans to crack management and avoid the mistake modern bosses make, his 'rhino skin', Man United regrets and why Sir Jim Ratcliffe's backing of Ruben Amorim is flawed

Not so long ago, Phil Jones didn’t much like talking about football. Not to his team-mates at Manchester United, such was the shame he felt at the long injury nightmare that ended his playing career. Nor to the fans, for fear that the abuse he suffered on social media might be directed at him in the street.

That was a year ago, after Jones succumbed to crippling knee problems and hung up his boots at the age of 32, following 13 years at United and 27 appearances for England.

Now, though, he can look back more positively on his life as a footballer - and forward to a new career in coaching and, hopefully, management. So much so that he is convinced the problems of the past will be invaluable to him in the future.

There is no doubt that the physical and psychological issues he faced as a player will help with the pastoral care needed when working with a dressing room full of young men.

‘Absolutely,’ Jones tells Daily Mail Sport. ‘The adversity I’ve gone through in my career, I definitely feel you’ve got to have rhino skin in this game. I think that will be advantageous for me.

‘You can be the best manager in the world tactically, in possession, out of possession, cute little set-plays – and you have to have that by the way, especially at the highest level.

‘But if players can’t relate to you these days, and they don’t feel they can interact with you… can you talk to them about something other than football? Does it always have to be football? Football, football, football.

‘Some coaches or managers can’t put the board away. You have to learn to switch off and that’s a skill. To be able to switch off and come home to your kids and family and have that life balance.

‘If you only have the tactical side, well, you might get through the first year, but there’s no longevity to it because players will see straight through it and you have to have that relationship with players these days.

‘Being a human being. A player needs to feel warmth. Take them on a journey if you’re explaining to them about a chance they missed, or a position they should have taken up on the pitch or a rotation that’s not worked.

‘Don’t just say “you should have been here”. Take them on a journey why. “I did the same in this game” or “in the 60th minute when you did that, brilliant, but what about that – do you think you could have been a bit more…?” Don’t just throw them under the bus because you’ve lost the game.

‘It’s too easy these days for managers to say “he’s not good enough”. Why’s he not good enough? It’s your job to make them good enough. That’s why you were brought in, to get the best out of them.

‘To come in and say “he’s not for me”, I don’t buy that. Maybe after six months or a year. I get that, but not when you come in the door and go “he’s not for me, not good enough, won’t play in my team”. It’s your job to get him to that level.’

Eloquent, intelligent and thoughtful, Jones is thinking and talking about the game in a different way since he started doing his coaching badges.

It involved working with the youngsters at Carrington for two seasons and the Pro Licence should be ‘boxed off this time next year’ according to the defender who made his name at Blackburn Rovers before a £16.5millon move to Old Trafford in 2011.

‘I look back now and think I’ve had a great career,’ says Jones, speaking with BetMGM. ‘When I was in the Under 18s at Blackburn, did I think I would have played in two World Cups? No. I’ve been to a Euros, won the Premier League and FA Cup and played in some big Champions League games.

‘I’ve had a really good career. Would I like to have played more and in certain games I didn’t get to play in? Of course I would. But I could only give what I could give. Everything that was in my control, I tried to control.

‘After I got my A Licence, I spoke with Nick Cox, United’s academy director at the time. I really wanted to go in and enhance my understanding and learning. It was a long time since I was in the academy at Blackburn. I wanted to give myself that time.

‘I didn’t want to just come out of the game and say, “I’ll take that manager's job". I wanted to go about it the right way. Just because I played at United for 13 years, you can’t expect to get the biggest jobs.

‘I was on the grass with the kids coaching, and you come away from a session thinking, “How can I adapt, how can I change it, how can I make it better?”.

‘You start thinking about the game more. I don’t just watch a game of football now, you’re engrossed in patterns of play and systems and how they set up tactically in and out of possession.’

So is Jones ready for a coaching job at the age of 33? And if so, what type of role?

‘I don’t think there’s a right or wrong way. People say to me go and take an Under 18s, some say go and be an assistant somewhere. Do I think I’m ready to become a manager? No. I’m not naive and daft enough to think I’m just going to walk into a job. It doesn’t work like that. I have to earn the right with steps and progression.

‘But do I think I could add value into a team now? Yeah. I played under a lot of good managers and with good players, I've taken a lot of things from various parts of the game on and off the pitch. That’s the goal. That’s where I want to be. Let’s see.’

Jones is already learning about how the wheels turn in managerial circles.

‘It’s something I’m getting used to,’ he says. ‘It’s not what you know, it’s who you know. You see people getting jobs – managers, assistants or coaches or Under 21s – and when you dissect it, you can piece the puzzle together; why they got it, whether they played with them or connected on the same course, or the same agent.

‘When I came out of playing, was I used to taking that coffee or round of golf with someone to go and meet them? No.

‘When I was playing, was I the guy pulling his socks up to wait for the manager to walk in so I could have a conversation? That just wasn’t who I was. I knew my worth. I didn’t need any validation from coaches and managers, I knew myself when I walked off the pitch if I’d had a good game or a s*** game.

‘I’m not daft. It takes time and hopefully in the next six months or year I will have a job of some sort and be in and around a team that I feel passionate about to work in.

‘Listen, I’m not in a rush. I’m not clawing at the walls by any stretch of the imagination. But I love the game and I’d love to be back involved.

‘I came out of it and I want to work. I’m ambitious. I love watching football. I’ve watched League Two games this season as well as Championship and Champions League games. I love watching any type of football to broaden my knowledge and understanding of the game.’

When Jones turned up for Wrexham’s game against QPR last month, he caused quite a stir. He was pictured watching the game in a private box with co-owner and Hollywood star Ryan Reynolds when in fact he was there at the invitation of chief executive Michael Williamson. 

‘Nothing surprises me about social media,’ says Jones with a smile. ‘You can’t even go to a ground and watch a game of football without people linking you with something.

‘He (Reynolds) is a really nice fella but I’m good friends with Michael. I’ve known him for years and he invited me to the game. I’ve followed Wrexham quite a lot because of the connection with Michael. They’ve done well with back-to-back promotions and Phil Parkinson has done a brilliant job.’

Which brings us to Jones’ old club and Ruben Amorim. United’s head coach has been under early-season pressure and heads to Anfield on Sunday for another huge game. He does so with a public endorsement from minority owner Sir Jim Ratcliffe, who has claimed the Portuguese coach should be judged over another two years. Jones has been around the game long enough to know it’s not guaranteed that Amorim will be given that long.

‘Do I want to see any manager or coach losing their job? No, especially with the route I want go down now. You need time to get your squad together,’ he says. ‘I like the fact Sir Jim Ratcliffe has come out and backed him, as you would expect. But it’s a results business. If you don’t get results, I don’t care what length of contract you’re on – 10 years, two years, five years – there will be questions and you will be looked at.

‘Sunderland (a 2-0 win before the international break) was probably the most complete performance I’ve seen from United this season in every department. But then you play Liverpool, your fierce rivals (on Sunday). If you don’t win there, you’ve got Brighton coming up and that’s not an easy game the way they’re playing at the minute.   

‘If you get a draw against Liverpool and then go and beat Brighton at home, you’ve gathered a bit of momentum and can they really kick on and use it as a catalyst to do something? How many times have we said that over the last six years? Would I like to see Amorim succeed, do really well in the back end of this season and maybe win a trophy? Of course. I’d love nothing more.’

Jones’ last away game for United came at Anfield in April 2022, when they suffered a 4-0 defeat under Ralf Rangnick. He played in a 2-1 victory for Louis van Gaal’s side in March 2015, but United have only won once there since.

‘There is no better place to go and win than Liverpool in their own backyard,’ he says. ‘It’s everything that comes with this game. The media speculation during the week, more cameras around the training ground, more people talking about it, the build-up on Sky Sports.

‘Everything is about United and Liverpool and the players are so aware of it. They know it’s a huge game, not just for them and the club but for the fans. When you get there, it’s a difficult ground to play football in. Gary Neville says it’s one of the most difficult grounds you’ll ever go to; the atmosphere, the nice hatred between the two clubs and the history of the rivalry.

‘It’s intense, it’s frantic but, my God, what a game to play in if you can win!’